The genocide is still ongoing and many things are still developing in Palestine, but we are removing the limitation on only posting things related to the operation Flood of Al-Aqsa to this thread, you can now freely post over Lemmygrad again.
Please don’t stop talking about Palestine.
Due to popular demand, please keep all posts about the operation to this megathread, sitewide.
The zionists funneled the residents of Gaza at the Egyptian border, telling them that’s where they were allowed to escape.
Then they bombed it.
The world is literally watching a holocaust happen. Not just reading about it like in the 40s. But watching it. And liberals are either ignoring it or standing with the ones perpetrating it.
Not a single person who stands with Israel should be allowed to forget what they supported.
Not just reading about it like in the 40s. But watching it. And liberals are either ignoring it or standing with the ones perpetrating it.
They did the same exact thing almost a century ago. It was the Red Army who brought the Holocaust to an end, not the West.
We are run by a neoliberal crowd of crooked scumbags. Irish people like to pride ourselves as some kind of freedom fighting rebels in our idealistic daydreams. When it comes to material reality, we vote in wankers who run the state as an oppressive arm of the USA. The people see themselves as one thing but when push comes to shove we’re no different to the people who oppressed us.
I gotta be honest, if any country could vote itself into actual socialism, it feels like it would be Ireland lol
My city just refused a pro Palestina protest that was planned tomorrow. The same city of which the far right mayor today remembered Israeli victims and called Palestina’s uprising terrorism. The same city of which the police force has recently been trained by the Israeli police force.
The protest is still happening, albeit at a different place. And I’ll be going.
I was off the grid without internet for the past week, and I come back online to find out that the Third Intifada may have started. It’s one of those weeks Lenin told us about. Here’s hoping this is the beginning of something really meaningful to Palestinian freedom.
REMEMBER: the Occupier is unpopular the world over. People by and large stand with Palestine, even in the imperial core. The reason they are trying to outlaw protests for Palestine and supporting Palestine is because the ruling ideas are the ideas of the ruling class, and governments want to make their people think that support for Palestine is lower than it really is.
Israel has threatened Syria and Lebanon if they enter the conflict that Israel will wipe them off the face of the earth, rumors of the US and Israel discussing joint action if things escalate.
Not fear mongering or anything, but This could very quickly fall into a global conflict. Eyes on the news comrades.
Also a sad reminder the US gave Israel nuclear weapons and it is the known ‘unofficial’ but stated policy of that regime to use their nuclear weapons in revenge strikes should their regime fall or be in significant danger of falling.
Yeah, things went from oh boy hope the US and Russia don’t fight to, oh boy, I hope the entire world doesn’t nuke each other because Israel has to keep being an apartheid, like really really bad, in like 48 hours. Got whiplash at this point.
Biden first: ‘I totally saw images of beheaded babies!’
White House statement now: ‘Biden did not ever see those images and they can’t be verified’
Libs and others, if you are reading this, please support the right side of history. You are propagandized to hell the same way people were with Iraq, Vietnam, Cuba etc.
Israel has the better weapons and allies in terms of military power. That’s not always the most important thing, but what are the prospects of Palestina being successful? And what possible allies will they have? I don’t see Iran coming to help anytime soon tbh.
I saw Scott Ritter had some interesting insights that MSM, as usual, is missing: Palestinians have much more will to fight. Israelis are a settler nation and most of them have second citizenships they can flee to. Palestinians don’t. For a Palestinian soldier the consequence of surrender is just a slower death than what they’d get if they keep fighting. An Israeli on the battlefield has a lot more to lose from taking any risks compared to fleeing. A Palestinian soldier has nowhere to flee to.
He also noted that if Hezbollah commit as well, all of Israel’s neighbours are gonna see it as a now-or-never chance to finally rid themselves of having a nuclear-armed US puppet on their doorstep; and if they don’t take it and let Israel make a bloodbath of Gaza and the West Bank, they’ll become more stable and consolidated than ever.
To add to what you’re arguing, every time Gaza is bombarded, more people are displaced, more people are left without a home, more people are radicalized and therefore the number of members in the militia grows. What is someone, who is physically apt to fight, going to do in such a situation? No home, nowhere to go unless you can somewhat cross half of occupied Palestine. Every member of the militia is nothing but a radicalized civilian, and every civilian is a potential militia member.
This is probably why Israel enacted the Hannibal plan, which is essentially that they will kill IOF soldiers before they let them be captured.
What is iof?
Israeli Offense/Occupation Force
Nice.
So what were you saying? Israel intends to kill its own instead of letting them get captured?
Yeah, that’s the basis of the “Hannibal” protocol: IOF soldiers are allowed to do everything in their power in order to prevent a capture.
Can see that back firing a little. If a soldier does have somewhere else to go (foreign passport) and the fighting on the front is bleak, will they flee or stay and risk being killed by their own side? It’s got to be an incentive to leave for some. Some will be in it for the fight, but many settlers will be in it for an easier life. As soon as it’s not the easier option, I would bet that many will leave.
Probably idf
Please Hezbollah do not stop at potshots…please
In Biden’s speech, he talked about how he spoke to Golda Meir when he was a senator and she told him “We have a secret weapon: we have no where else to go.”
They have a lot more places to go than the people of Palestine.
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That’s not what I’ve been seeing with them all fleeing to Ben Gurion Airport to take the first flight back to the US lmao
Those videos make me laugh.
I see the situation as a Warsaw Ghetto Uprising situation. They aren’t meant to succeed. It’s a desperate measure to risk it all for a chance of survival, or die trying.
The Germans had more men who were experienced, veteran soldiers with tanks, and superior weapons; but the Jewish fighters still tried.
It’s a suicide mission, but they’ve accepted the costs. We can only hope for their success.
Coincidentally, I was just thinking about how the Jews in Axis‐occupied Warsaw and the Palestinians today have more common with each other than either of them have with the Zionist ruling class. Perhaps the Warsaw Jews and the Zionist ruling class are closer to each other in terms of heritage, but in what really matters—situations, experiences, circumstances, spirit—it’s no contest: the Palestinians and the Warsaw Jews may as well be literal siblings. As for the Zionist ruling class, personally I’d say that it’s far more akin to the Ottoman Empire’s anti‐Armenian rulers than to Warsaw’s Jews.
As a gentile I tend to be very reluctant to compare anything to the Shoah, and if we want to discuss the technicalities, then yes, the oppression of Palestinians is not a one‐to‐one copy of the Shoah. But at the end of the day, the technicalities hardly matter: the Palestinians remain victims of colonial atrocities. Atrocities similar to what the Native Americans, the Aboriginal Australians, the Armenians, the Libyans, the Ethiopians, the Roma, and others have faced in history. That’s why I made an image of the neocolonial flag with the fascio littorio on it: if anybody finds the comparisons to the Third Reich inappropriate (and I agree that there are important differences…as well as similarities), it would suffice to draw comparisons to another atrocious empire in history instead.
warsaw uprising was very different though, the government of poland was trying to establish an anti-communist government before the soviets got there.
The Warsaw Ghetto Uprising was a desperate effort and bloody uprising by Jewish partisans in 1943 in response to the Waffen SS liquidating the ghetto and executing anyone who still remained.
The Warsaw Ghetto Uprising and Warsaw Uprising were two different events nearly a year apart.
Yeah I know, I just didn’t see ‘Ghetto’
sorry
All good, we all make mistakes like that. I’ve typed out whole responses to people and then go back only to realize I missed the point lmao
Warsaw ghetto uprising not Warsaw uprising. 2 separate things.
oh fuck yeah dammit, didn’t see that
Hezbollah in Lebanon exchanged fire with Israel https://www.barrons.com/news/lebanon-s-hezbollah-says-it-fired-shells-guided-missiles-at-israel-f2316a1b
So, the most important answer we have so far to your question is that this appears to have been a massive victory for Palestinian counter-intelligence. If they managed to plan, prepare, and execute this without Israel or any of the 5 Eyes seeing it, then it tells us something profoundly important.
There are second order implications if this is true. The most important second order implication is that if their counter-intelligence is truly that good, then they’re unlikely to have only used it to plan an initial strike. If your counter-intelligence is working that well, then it becomes possible to prepare and plan multiple moves into the future.
Another second order implication is that it is likely that Palestinian counter-intelligence did not develop on its own but instead with support from other actors. That would imply the existence of alliances that are providing some kind of support.
If both of those are true, then the second and third moves that are planned likely involve support from allies. That could be exit routes, it could be material support, it could be geopolitical support through diplomacy, sanctions, and threats.
A lot of this hinges on the assessment that Israeli and 5 Eyes intelligence failed here. If it did, then we are at the beginning of a longer unfolding of events and need to watch carefully to understand what’s going on because if the West failed in this way, the propaganda is going to focus on hiding this failure and its implications.
Media over here already declared it a massive fuck up from Israeli and allied intelligence agencies. I think they actually did mess up. Which, for them, is a pretty worrying sign.
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I am worried about world war as well. Maybe even more than with Ukraine.
I wouldn’t worry that much, Netanyahu is a tool.
I highly doubt Netanyahu will have enough spine to do something so stupid.
I mean, look at Cuba, Vietnam, Afghanistan, Lebanon etc. Besides, Palestine has Iran, Syria, Lebanon and many more allies.
Words cannot describe the rage I am feeling right now. Palestine’s liberation is such a fucking softball, and if people can so easily cheer for their genocide I frankly don’t know what to do with myself in the US.
Apologies for the ‘Dear Diary’ type post, but I really just don’t know how to alleviate this intense feeling.
The EU gave a speech saying that ‘jews were killed just because they are jews, again’ so that might be the new tactic. Antisemitism and not, you know, colonialism or something.
Al-Qassam brigades have announced they will essentially* execute one prisoner for every Palestinian killed by the bombing on Gaza.
In my opinion this is the only thing they can do to regain control of the situation. Israel has been indiscriminately bombing Gaza since yesterday, and has already killed some of their own people in Gaza.
This is essentially shifting the power struggle to Hamas, who now gets to decide when POWs die instead of the IOF. We’ll see if it stops the bombing.
Israel is bombing indiscriminately. They don’t even know where these hostages are and could very well be bombing them. They don’t give a fuck about their own civilians in the first place.
Yeah part of me thinks they want all the hostages dead so they can better play up the Palestinians are barbarians who must be eradicated angle domestically and internationally. If they should have to help with that via bombing, being unreasonable, etc, I think the vile government there might consider that a small price to pay to finally get to carry out its genocide to the final stage.
The more dead white people the more CNN can sob about “monsters”. If you think liberals went crazy over relatively white looking Russians attacking honorary white Ukrainians you haven’t seen anything yet once the media whips people into a frenzy over the evil brown savage hordes massacring the innocent, beautiful whites. They could see a real opportunity here to create a power play where they can steamroll over decades of organizing against Israeli apartheid and in one emotional swoop push repressive laws into place criminalizing and clamping down hard on support of Palestine and basically driving the western consensus to no longer care about it, to label any support of Palestinians as antisemitism.
I mean you have to look for education at the US and things like operation Northwoods, strategy of tension, gladio, terrorism in Europe post WW2 and realize Israel received their education from these people. Their existing strategy we must remember includes things like inciting hatred of Jews by tying them to zionism to drive more Jews to Israel to increase their own legitimacy. That Jews die as part of that process is not a problem to them.
They’re already masters at spin, have numerous orgs aside from the bourgeois press set up for manipulation of opinions, spreading out of context photos, etc. So the blowback on them upping the ante by “refusing to give in to demands of terrorists” as they’ll put it will likely be very minimal, the dead hostages will be lionized, their deaths used to justify further atrocities and if any of their families deviate from that line and try to blame the regime in Tel Aviv, well, they’ll be silenced in short order, deplatformed.
The situation does not look great for an ideal resolution. The Palestinian people at this point just need to resist ferociously enough that the IDF is thrown back and can only engage in air strikes rather than actually succeeding in a ground operation.
Update: no hostages were executed
I thought the rhetoric in this was interesting:
https://www.npr.org/2023/10/09/1204639253/israel-gaza-hamas-us-citizens-killed
There’s all the passive voice and spin you’d expect, but they specifically quote:
She said that the images of Israeli civilians being killed and taken hostage are disturbing, something many do not want to see. But she said this kind of reaction was “expected.”
“We don’t like to see images like that, but it’s a fight,” Saeid said. “It’s a reaction for what Gazans here living since 2006 and since the occupation started, from 1948, and no one just caring about Gaza.”.
That’s not something I’d expect to read in imperial core media.
There are a lot more westerners that support Palestinians than you’d expect tbh, even in media.
I’ve seen comments about there being no hope for the Western left because of the liberal shittakes on social media.
But PSL and the Stop Cop City movement leaders have fully made it known that they are in complete solidarity with Palestine. Anarchists are as well.
The seeds are here. Don’t be hasty to judge the communist movement in the US by shitty liberals and social democrats bandwagoning online.
I have said this before but for all the reactionary aspects of US society there is still an element there that is quite a bit more radical than we have here in Europe. This partly has to do with the brutal hyper-capitalism having created material conditions for the bottom of society that are relatively worse in the US than in Europe’s social democratic welfare states. There is an interesting contradiction in that the US simultaneously has some of the worst reactionary tendencies due to its settler colonial nature and history, as well as its role as the center of world imperialism, but also one of the populations that is potentially most easily radicalizable among the nations of the imperial core. In Europe the absence of a social base that is as rife for radicalization as the indigenous and black communities in the US, for which current material conditions and historical injustices align to produce a real revolutionary subject, and with European countries having much more homogenous populations there is much less potential for development of revolutionary consciousness. Notable exceptions do exist such as in Ireland or Serbia, in the case of the former due to their specific history of anti-imperialist struggle and for the latter their recent experiences being directly victimized by imperialist aggression, though unfortunately both of these countries are currently governed by neoliberal sellouts.
even DSA is supporting Palestine in this conflict, like DSA national itself not just their international committee or radical local chapters.
Israel dropped 6000 bombs in the last few days. That’s as much as the US did on Afghanistan IN A YEAR. Afghanistan is 1800x bigger than Gaza.
Just went to the local Vigil for Palestine but apparently the org canceled it just before the start, because the city didn’t want to give a permit. Still like 150 people showed up to lay flowers and burn candles. Police being the fascist fucks they are started intimidating people mourning a massacre.
Fucking fascists
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Smarmy piece of shit
Here is his previous position on blockades and border closures (taken out of context for laughs).
https://nitter.net/JustinTrudeau/status/1494480040192626688
https://nitter.net/JustinTrudeau/status/1494382272673427456
https://nitter.net/JustinTrudeau/status/1492242944388124674So he is consistent. It’s just hidden. His main concern is ‘our economy’. If it disrupts ‘his’ economy, he’s against it. If it props it up, he’s for it.
