Who kept financing far right and nationalist movements, first amongst émigrés and then as soon as the iron curtain fell amongst soviet people?
Who made up all the anti-communist propaganda, turned natural disasters into genocides, financed “education” programs, “museums” like the occupation museum on Tbilisi, etc?
Who enforced neoliberal policies, shock therapy, etc?
Soviet people voted against dissolution of the USSR but comprador politicians ignored that, then Russian people were going to elect Zyuganov but US soft-couped him and stole the election for Yeltsin.
Who fucking financed Maidan and organised a coup? There’s literally a recording of Nuland deciding which politician gets what position in Ukrainian govt.
Then Ukrainian people elected Zelensky to make a deal with Russia which he tried to do, what happened to that?
And then “”““leftist””“” yanks will bumble around asking "why can’t those Eastern Europeans just be normal like the rest of the world?
A yank started the whole " why can’t Ukraine just be normal" thing, I can tell cause only a yank would refer to his homeland simply as “our country” without feeling the need to clarify which fucking country.
You’re from Yugoslavia of all places, you frequent a communist space, and you believe much of Eastern Europe is a Nazi hellhole because that’s just how Eastern Europeans are, abnormal?
Who’s normal? Yank leftists voting for a guy who bombed Yugoslavia cause “harm reduction”?
I have to endure and watch this shit every single fucking day: casual racism, homophobia, transphobia, aphobia, biphobia, sexism, abnormal religious fanaticism, watch monuments and praise for genocidal monarchs, nazi butchers and war criminals on every turn, get accused of ‘satanism’ on a daily basis, talking about conspiracy theories only someone high on heroin would say every single time a wind blows a bit harsher and that’s only these 4 and especially Serbia and most of these people are anti-west. And do I even need to get started on Baltics and co for example?
Obviously the answer is the US. We all know that. Doesn’t mean there isn’t a huge domestic nazi problem, either. As much as it saddens me, the historical presence of those forces is fertile soil for western imperialism and will continue to be so until the prevailing social current is to fight fascism rather than collaborate with it.
Not blaming Ukrainian voters, but we should also just accept by this point that Zelenskyy tricked a lot of people into believing he wanted to reunify the country and (somewhat) normalize things with Russia. “Electing” a US-coup puppet was never going to end well, regardless of the vibes. I do think, however, most people who did vote for him were honestly believed they were voting to end the atrocities.
Literally everything Eastern Europe has to do is to stop praising, supporting and building monuments for fucking nazis and be normal, really hard part for a lot of them.
Does that ring true to you or is there more to it than Eastern Europeans being abnormal?
Is being normal really “everything Eastern Europe has to do”, or are there maybe some changes needed in the west for that normality to happen?
No, I’m not supporting that statement. It’s too reductive and I understand why you have some very raw nerves on the subject; I certainly do.
I think we may be interpreting the intent a little differently, though. I mostly feel like I’m just helplessly drowning in sadness and horror in front of a screen all the time, and I generally try to cope with satire or sarcasm. I try to avoid being quite this glib or insensitive, but I probably fuck that up a lot, too. Reads that way to me at least.
why can’t those Eastern Europeans just be normal like the rest of the world
Now that I think about it… Let’s define “normal”. Does a country that:
conducted over 300 interventions (including wars/invasions, coups, acts of political meddling, sabotage and terrorism) since 1776
inflicted more deaths and suffering cumulatively (directly or indirectly) than any empire in history
supported and/or inspired virtually all reactionary anti-communist and colonial movements in existence - monarchists, fascists (including the Nazis), the Contras, the Zionists, you name it
crushed the majority of governments that were attempting economic sovereignty, let alone socialist transition
nazified many former socialist countries to oblivion, at least partially for the sake of punishing them for the impunity of revolution
went ahead and plundered the entire world
meet the definition of “normal”?
All I can say is… If we, Eastern Europeans, are not normal, then surely the country in question doesn’t meet the definition of normality either. And I’m not trying to absolve the Banderites or the neo-Ustase or whoever from responsibility - they all should get the wall, but… If you want to be insanely reductive, at the very least do it in a materialist way.
How did it get there?
Who kept financing far right and nationalist movements, first amongst émigrés and then as soon as the iron curtain fell amongst soviet people?
Who made up all the anti-communist propaganda, turned natural disasters into genocides, financed “education” programs, “museums” like the occupation museum on Tbilisi, etc?
Who enforced neoliberal policies, shock therapy, etc?
Soviet people voted against dissolution of the USSR but comprador politicians ignored that, then Russian people were going to elect Zyuganov but US soft-couped him and stole the election for Yeltsin.
Who fucking financed Maidan and organised a coup? There’s literally a recording of Nuland deciding which politician gets what position in Ukrainian govt.
Then Ukrainian people elected Zelensky to make a deal with Russia which he tried to do, what happened to that?
And then “”““leftist””“” yanks will bumble around asking "why can’t those Eastern Europeans just be normal like the rest of the world?
Fuck right off, all of you.
I know all of that.
Where do you think I’m from? lmao
A yank started the whole " why can’t Ukraine just be normal" thing, I can tell cause only a yank would refer to his homeland simply as “our country” without feeling the need to clarify which fucking country.
Right from the middle of this shithole called Serbia, Bosnia, Montenegro and Macedonia which was previously Yugoslavia:
You’re from Yugoslavia of all places, you frequent a communist space, and you believe much of Eastern Europe is a Nazi hellhole because that’s just how Eastern Europeans are, abnormal?
Who’s normal? Yank leftists voting for a guy who bombed Yugoslavia cause “harm reduction”?
I have to endure and watch this shit every single fucking day: casual racism, homophobia, transphobia, aphobia, biphobia, sexism, abnormal religious fanaticism, watch monuments and praise for genocidal monarchs, nazi butchers and war criminals on every turn, get accused of ‘satanism’ on a daily basis, talking about conspiracy theories only someone high on heroin would say every single time a wind blows a bit harsher and that’s only these 4 and especially Serbia and most of these people are anti-west. And do I even need to get started on Baltics and co for example?
We WERE normal, now definitely not.
Obviously the answer is the US. We all know that. Doesn’t mean there isn’t a huge domestic nazi problem, either. As much as it saddens me, the historical presence of those forces is fertile soil for western imperialism and will continue to be so until the prevailing social current is to fight fascism rather than collaborate with it.
Not blaming Ukrainian voters, but we should also just accept by this point that Zelenskyy tricked a lot of people into believing he wanted to reunify the country and (somewhat) normalize things with Russia. “Electing” a US-coup puppet was never going to end well, regardless of the vibes. I do think, however, most people who did vote for him were honestly believed they were voting to end the atrocities.
Ok so then what about this?
Does that ring true to you or is there more to it than Eastern Europeans being abnormal?
Is being normal really “everything Eastern Europe has to do”, or are there maybe some changes needed in the west for that normality to happen?
No, I’m not supporting that statement. It’s too reductive and I understand why you have some very raw nerves on the subject; I certainly do.
I think we may be interpreting the intent a little differently, though. I mostly feel like I’m just helplessly drowning in sadness and horror in front of a screen all the time, and I generally try to cope with satire or sarcasm. I try to avoid being quite this glib or insensitive, but I probably fuck that up a lot, too. Reads that way to me at least.
Now that I think about it… Let’s define “normal”. Does a country that:
meet the definition of “normal”?
All I can say is… If we, Eastern Europeans, are not normal, then surely the country in question doesn’t meet the definition of normality either. And I’m not trying to absolve the Banderites or the neo-Ustase or whoever from responsibility - they all should get the wall, but… If you want to be insanely reductive, at the very least do it in a materialist way.