Most serial killers, most violent offenders, are men.
In the US, violent offenders are also disproportionately performed by black folk (including being an actual majority for homicide and robbery). I suspect you don’t think we should make assumptions about black folks being violent though? I doubt you think when someone is killed we should simply assume the killer is black because the killer is usually black?
And note, I’m not arguing that we should - I’m using it as an illustrative point of why this line of thinking is bullshit.
The trend for violence between genders is not only worldwide, it’s also over thousands of years. Especially if we include war* and describe toxic masculinity as a classic soldier (emotionless, disposable, not allowed to be an independent or critical thinker, narcissism to deal with fear, projection to deal with unhappiness).
The reason black men are disproportionately charged in the US with crimes is due to white supremacy, including within the police force, which has been information in the public knowledge since BLM protests so stop playing stupid.
The reason black men are disproportionately charged in the US with crimes is due to white supremacy, including within the police force, which has been information in the public knowledge since BLM protests so stop playing stupid.
You can make that argument for things like nonviolent drug charges and the like (and that’s why you’re saying “crimes” and not “violent crimes” or “homicide”, and to be clear I absolutely agree with you that police are more likely to arrest black folks for nonviolent crimes than whites), but I specifically was pointing to violent crimes and in particular homicide. The “fun” thing about homicide is that it’s hard to invent homicides whole cloth, and you can’t just plant a homicide in someone’s car to “discover” when you search them or w/e. And when you get into homicide, in most cases perpetrator and victim are the same race.
So in your scenario how would police white supremacy cause the effect shown in the stats? Do the police just ignore dead white folks, because they are more likely to have been killed by other whites? Do they send extra effort investigating the deaths of black folks, because they were likely killed by other blacks? Is there a secret, nationwide conspiracy whereby every law enforcement institution secretly murders black folks and then manufactures evidence to frame other black folks for it at a later date, and everyone from officers to coroners to forensic techs to prosecutors, judges and jurors are all in on it?
But to double down on my original argument, when you start looking at criminal justice stats, usually when there’s a racial gap that harms black folks there’s also a sex gap that harms men. Your argument that racial gaps are definitely just bigotry but men are just violent monsters who should be (for example) disproportionately killed by police, be more likely to be prosecuted when arrested, be more likely to be arrested for nonviolent crimes, should receive higher bail for the same charge and longer sentences for the same charge, etc, etc? And you don’t see the bigotry in saying that?
Yes, police have actively been using black people as scapegoats for homicide that the police carry out for decades. There used to be a code police would put on bodies in the 80s and before - “DNE” do not investigate, indicating a homeless person or sex worker who probably will never be identified. However, it has been found, particularly with LAPD, that they were using this indiscriminately and many cops through the years were found to have covered their own murders with this code. It’s so common I first heard about it on fucking Forensic Files. Just like one of the most common demographics for arsonists is fireman, police seem to be a very common demographic for violent offender. WELL above normal for violent crimes for police, and that’s with the entire judicial system helping them out, immunity, etc. And you think that this ultra violent police force is accurately arresting and attributing those crimes? Lol
Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, who yes tortured people in Guantanamo, wasn’t arrested for violent crimes. They were state approved. Public shooters, school shooters, going postal shooters, were all typically white male shooters (the one black shooter I can think of was a cop).
White male violence is simply allowed at greater levels than anyone else’s violence. Because we live in a white supremacist heteropatriarchy.
Yes, police have actively been using black people as scapegoats for homicide that the police carry out for decades. There used to be a code police would put on bodies in the 80s and before - “DNE” do not investigate, indicating a homeless person or sex worker who probably will never be identified. However, it has been found, particularly with LAPD, that they were using this indiscriminately and many cops through the years were found to have covered their own murders with this code.
“DNE” is the opposite of inventing evidence to prosecute black folks for killings secretly done by police - it’s institutionally telling everyone to drop the ball on this one. For “DNE” to be a significant part of what the statistics show while your beliefs remains also true, cops would have to be going around killing and "DNE"ing white folks (which seems backwards from what you’d expect from people driven by white supremacy) and/or have an elaborate conspiracy all the way along the chain from cops to coroners to forensic techs to prosecutors to judges to jurors to frame black folks for murders of other black folks.
Because again, for homicide and race statistics to be what they are because of white supremacist policing there either have to be a bunch of white killings not being counted as homicides at all, or a bunch of totally fabricated frame jobs for killings of blacks fabricated in a conspiracy that is shockingly tight lipped despite being utterly massive (something like a third of all US homicide to bring black homicide rates in line with share of population) and spanning decades.
More likely is what you find when you dig deeper - a huge proportion of homicide in the US is gang related and young black men are the primary gang recruitment demographic for a mix of cultural and mostly economic reasons.
Public shooters, school shooters, going postal shooters, were all typically white male shooters (the one black shooter I can think of was a cop).
Yes, public mass shooters tend to be white men, typically young ones. There’s about 25,000 homicides per year in the US. Since the 60s, public mass shootings have accounted for a total of about 1,500 of those (not 1,500 per year, 1,500 total). And those shooters either die on the scene because the whole point was to kill themselves and take a bunch of innocents with them, or get tried and convicted.
You’ll note I said public mass shooters instead of just mass shooters, because the difference is relevant. It’s a trick of the statistics - when talking about how bad mass shootings are, people will point to Sandy Hook, Columbine, Aurora, Pulse, etc but when talking about how often they happen will include any shooting with three or more casualties. If you limit your talk of mass shootings to only include shootings that were not limited to a single private residence (such as home invasions and family annihilators, which tend to have different demographics) and were not done as part of some other criminal activity (a lot of those are gang or cartel related, and have different demos as a result), then what you’re left with is mostly young white guys in dire need of mental health assistance who decided to take a bunch of people with them when they killed themselves (as in Columbine) and the remainder are mostly white supremacists who think they’re acting to defend the white race (as in Christchurch) or some similar bullshit.
Yes, white supremacy for decades means that the police force, a former KKK offshoot, has been killing and scapegoating black men since their inception. This is known. Literally it’s the history of the police. Lol.
And the CIA and FBI have never had anything to do with gang violence here, the crack epidemic, or gang violence south of the border, right? So white men cant possibly be responsible for the gang violence in this country either /s.
Men are violent. They are violent to each other and other men. Per Robert Sapolsky, Cordelia Fine, many neuroscientists, and myself, this is a socialized trait and not biological destiny. But it is definitely a trait. Black men are not more violent than white men, especially when you look at global context and the context of those studies which are a snapshot of systemic racism that has been going on in the US and globally for hundreds of years now.
Yes, white supremacy for decades means that the police force, a former KKK offshoot, has been killing and scapegoating black men since their inception. This is known. Literally it’s the history of the police. Lol.
I don’t think you grasp the scale of what you’re arguing. For the stats to really mean that black folk are no more likely to commit homicide than white folk, a majority of homicides black folks are charged with (to the tune of thousands of homicides every year since we’ve started keeping the stats) would have to be frame jobs. Every level of the criminal justice system would have to be in on the manufacture of evidence and frames, nationwide, for decades, with no leaks. No lab tech coming out and admitting to falsifying hundreds of tests because he was told those test needed to show particular black people were guilty even though they weren’t, no officers, prosecutors or judges with a guilty conscience. Hell, Kamala Harris would have had to play an instrumental role in intentionally framing at least a couple dozen black folks every year she was part of the criminal justice system.
Modern police descending from slave catchers and constables a century and a half ago is not proof of a massive nationwide conspiracy to frame thousands of black folks for homicide every year. No more so than Margret Sanger’s racism proves that Planned Parenthood is a white supremacist eugenics program.
In the US, violent offenders are also disproportionately performed by black folk (including being an actual majority for homicide and robbery). I suspect you don’t think we should make assumptions about black folks being violent though? I doubt you think when someone is killed we should simply assume the killer is black because the killer is usually black?
And note, I’m not arguing that we should - I’m using it as an illustrative point of why this line of thinking is bullshit.
The trend for violence between genders is not only worldwide, it’s also over thousands of years. Especially if we include war* and describe toxic masculinity as a classic soldier (emotionless, disposable, not allowed to be an independent or critical thinker, narcissism to deal with fear, projection to deal with unhappiness).
The reason black men are disproportionately charged in the US with crimes is due to white supremacy, including within the police force, which has been information in the public knowledge since BLM protests so stop playing stupid.
You can make that argument for things like nonviolent drug charges and the like (and that’s why you’re saying “crimes” and not “violent crimes” or “homicide”, and to be clear I absolutely agree with you that police are more likely to arrest black folks for nonviolent crimes than whites), but I specifically was pointing to violent crimes and in particular homicide. The “fun” thing about homicide is that it’s hard to invent homicides whole cloth, and you can’t just plant a homicide in someone’s car to “discover” when you search them or w/e. And when you get into homicide, in most cases perpetrator and victim are the same race.
So in your scenario how would police white supremacy cause the effect shown in the stats? Do the police just ignore dead white folks, because they are more likely to have been killed by other whites? Do they send extra effort investigating the deaths of black folks, because they were likely killed by other blacks? Is there a secret, nationwide conspiracy whereby every law enforcement institution secretly murders black folks and then manufactures evidence to frame other black folks for it at a later date, and everyone from officers to coroners to forensic techs to prosecutors, judges and jurors are all in on it?
But to double down on my original argument, when you start looking at criminal justice stats, usually when there’s a racial gap that harms black folks there’s also a sex gap that harms men. Your argument that racial gaps are definitely just bigotry but men are just violent monsters who should be (for example) disproportionately killed by police, be more likely to be prosecuted when arrested, be more likely to be arrested for nonviolent crimes, should receive higher bail for the same charge and longer sentences for the same charge, etc, etc? And you don’t see the bigotry in saying that?
Yes, police have actively been using black people as scapegoats for homicide that the police carry out for decades. There used to be a code police would put on bodies in the 80s and before - “DNE” do not investigate, indicating a homeless person or sex worker who probably will never be identified. However, it has been found, particularly with LAPD, that they were using this indiscriminately and many cops through the years were found to have covered their own murders with this code. It’s so common I first heard about it on fucking Forensic Files. Just like one of the most common demographics for arsonists is fireman, police seem to be a very common demographic for violent offender. WELL above normal for violent crimes for police, and that’s with the entire judicial system helping them out, immunity, etc. And you think that this ultra violent police force is accurately arresting and attributing those crimes? Lol
Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, who yes tortured people in Guantanamo, wasn’t arrested for violent crimes. They were state approved. Public shooters, school shooters, going postal shooters, were all typically white male shooters (the one black shooter I can think of was a cop).
White male violence is simply allowed at greater levels than anyone else’s violence. Because we live in a white supremacist heteropatriarchy.
“DNE” is the opposite of inventing evidence to prosecute black folks for killings secretly done by police - it’s institutionally telling everyone to drop the ball on this one. For “DNE” to be a significant part of what the statistics show while your beliefs remains also true, cops would have to be going around killing and "DNE"ing white folks (which seems backwards from what you’d expect from people driven by white supremacy) and/or have an elaborate conspiracy all the way along the chain from cops to coroners to forensic techs to prosecutors to judges to jurors to frame black folks for murders of other black folks.
Because again, for homicide and race statistics to be what they are because of white supremacist policing there either have to be a bunch of white killings not being counted as homicides at all, or a bunch of totally fabricated frame jobs for killings of blacks fabricated in a conspiracy that is shockingly tight lipped despite being utterly massive (something like a third of all US homicide to bring black homicide rates in line with share of population) and spanning decades.
More likely is what you find when you dig deeper - a huge proportion of homicide in the US is gang related and young black men are the primary gang recruitment demographic for a mix of cultural and mostly economic reasons.
Yes, public mass shooters tend to be white men, typically young ones. There’s about 25,000 homicides per year in the US. Since the 60s, public mass shootings have accounted for a total of about 1,500 of those (not 1,500 per year, 1,500 total). And those shooters either die on the scene because the whole point was to kill themselves and take a bunch of innocents with them, or get tried and convicted.
You’ll note I said public mass shooters instead of just mass shooters, because the difference is relevant. It’s a trick of the statistics - when talking about how bad mass shootings are, people will point to Sandy Hook, Columbine, Aurora, Pulse, etc but when talking about how often they happen will include any shooting with three or more casualties. If you limit your talk of mass shootings to only include shootings that were not limited to a single private residence (such as home invasions and family annihilators, which tend to have different demographics) and were not done as part of some other criminal activity (a lot of those are gang or cartel related, and have different demos as a result), then what you’re left with is mostly young white guys in dire need of mental health assistance who decided to take a bunch of people with them when they killed themselves (as in Columbine) and the remainder are mostly white supremacists who think they’re acting to defend the white race (as in Christchurch) or some similar bullshit.
Yes, white supremacy for decades means that the police force, a former KKK offshoot, has been killing and scapegoating black men since their inception. This is known. Literally it’s the history of the police. Lol.
https://naacp.org/find-resources/history-explained/origins-modern-day-policing
And the CIA and FBI have never had anything to do with gang violence here, the crack epidemic, or gang violence south of the border, right? So white men cant possibly be responsible for the gang violence in this country either /s.
Men are violent. They are violent to each other and other men. Per Robert Sapolsky, Cordelia Fine, many neuroscientists, and myself, this is a socialized trait and not biological destiny. But it is definitely a trait. Black men are not more violent than white men, especially when you look at global context and the context of those studies which are a snapshot of systemic racism that has been going on in the US and globally for hundreds of years now.
I don’t think you grasp the scale of what you’re arguing. For the stats to really mean that black folk are no more likely to commit homicide than white folk, a majority of homicides black folks are charged with (to the tune of thousands of homicides every year since we’ve started keeping the stats) would have to be frame jobs. Every level of the criminal justice system would have to be in on the manufacture of evidence and frames, nationwide, for decades, with no leaks. No lab tech coming out and admitting to falsifying hundreds of tests because he was told those test needed to show particular black people were guilty even though they weren’t, no officers, prosecutors or judges with a guilty conscience. Hell, Kamala Harris would have had to play an instrumental role in intentionally framing at least a couple dozen black folks every year she was part of the criminal justice system.
Modern police descending from slave catchers and constables a century and a half ago is not proof of a massive nationwide conspiracy to frame thousands of black folks for homicide every year. No more so than Margret Sanger’s racism proves that Planned Parenthood is a white supremacist eugenics program.
OK well that’s your opinion, it’s wrong and racist but it’s yours